IMPORTANT: Guild expiration - we need input!

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IMPORTANT: Guild expiration - we need input!

Post  Darke on Wed May 21, 2008 7:55 pm

Contact all your guild mates and make sure they read this thread!

The guild will expire on the 26th of May. You can verify this in Mabinogi by opening your friends window (press F) and clicking on the guild button. The expiration date is displayed at the top of the window.

I’ve contacted Nowaki, and she confirmed that she and Inyala have lost interest in active leadership of RPSociety. Nowaki does not plan to invest any more of her money in Mabinogi. Nowaki still monitors the forum and I hope she will verify this for you.

I have many friends in this guild and would like to see it continue, in one way or another!
Nowaki mentioned two possible solutions to keep the guild running: We could gather funds for Inyala to renew the guild, or Inyala can hand off leadership to someone else. I like Inyala and want to see her continue playing, but I personally would feel more comfortable with a more active leader.

Leader Nominations
If we are to go on as a guild, I think we need a new leader. We’ve already lost some members in the last few days and I hope that by restoring a strong leadership we can bring them back. We have less than 5 days to choose one.

Here are the things I think we should look for in a leader. Only the first one is an actual requirement for the position, the rest are just my opinions so please feel free to discuss them.
  • The leader must have an active subscription for the guild to function. The leader must be able to keep that subscription active year round.
  • The leader should be fair and just.
  • The leader should be willing to devote several hours a week to guild maintenance, and show an active presence in Mabinogi at least two or three times a week.
  • The leader should be flexible enough to revise their opinions when confronted with a stronger, more logical counter argument. Don't be too proud to admit you're wrong or made a mistake.
  • The leader should be charismatic, a likable person that all our members can rally behind.
  • The leader should be trustworthy enough for members to confide in (without breaking our confidence) and trusting enough to confide in his or her members. I think part of what burned Inyala out was that she didn’t feel like she could address us about the things that were troubling her.


If you look over this list and a name springs to mind, please nominate them for the position! We’ll take a vote this weekend.

What troubles you about the guild now?
During this changing of the guard, this may be a good time to address your concerns about the guild as it is now. What would you like to see changed? I’ve spoken with several members and ex-members and here are the things I commonly heard and some of my ideas on how to fix them.
  1. “Few of the members are active.” “Many members wouldn’t talk to me.” ”The guild is too big.” “The close knit society feeling has disappeared.”
    All of these are related. I think we need to be a little more picky about who joins, or have a probationary period during which a new member shows us what he or she is made of. I remember early on Inyala asking us about new members she hadn’t seen active and dismissing the ones that no one would vouch for. I liked that, though I think it would be a good idea to leave a forum post open for a day on the topic before dismissing them, and be sure to send them a friendly note in Mabinogi explaining why they were dismissed.

  2. “There’s not enough RP in the RPS.”
    We have all these standards about guild chat and party chat being strictly OOC and people often took exception to me posting OOC brackets around things in these channels. I consider myself a relaxed roleplayer and am willing to dismiss occasional slips (spirits know I make enough of them myself), but I think we should all strive to stay in character as much as possible, and when we are out of character, we should try to designate that. In my opinion, in character and roleplaying should be the expected norm in an RP guild, not the exception.

    When someone slips up, we should encourage them to designate the ooc text, not jump on them. Only someone who consistently and blatantly refuses to conform to the standard should be brought to the attention of the officers.

  3. “Not enough officers/leadership.”
    Yeah, we need a few officers who are as strong, wise, just, and trustworthy as the leader should be to police the few issues that do crop up from time to time (like the next item.) These people should not rule with an iron fist, but they should be an authority that the other members can look to in times of need. We need to try to have at least one officer online as many hours of the day as possible, so there is almost always an authority onhand to witness and deal with problems. The officers should communicate with each other (in a private forum would be best, to log executive actions) and be sure to communicate non-sensitive issues to the general guild populace too.

  4. “There’s too much drama.”
    Drama here refers to the unwanted bickering between players. I enjoy dramatic roleplay! This is something for the officers to police. If someone is giving you unwanted attention in guild, call in an officer. If two parties are bickering in guild chat, an officer should warn them once to deal with it person to person or through the officers. If they keep it up, the only other choice is a boot from the guild, with a helpful note in game to the players involved and a post on the forum why it occurred. Hopefully they cool off, learn from the event, and can join the guild again.

  5. “No one helped me.” “People kept whining at me to do things for them.”
    I have no way to fix this, except to ask for more tolerance from everyone. This one is a double edged sword, because both sides think the other side is the one at fault.

    The second part of our name is Society. If we are to be a close knit society, we need to stand together. Sometimes we need to go out of our way to help people. Other times we have to realize that not everyone is there to serve our needs.

    I tried to help everyone I could whenever I had time. The problem with doing that is that several people needed help at the same times! Every once in a while, I even took time for my own pursuits. If you’re patient, I will eventually help each of you!

  6. “There are poorly named people in the guild.”
    I see both sides of this argument, but I tend to error on the side of tolerance. We are a world of souls stolen from other worlds! Who knows what naming standards these other worlds have? People say numbers have no place in role play names, but does any fan of “Logan’s Run” think Nao would reject a brave soul like Logan7 and deny his help against the fomors? I can’t say I’m thrilled with number names, popular culture names, or names that are phrases, but I can not dismiss them as “non-RP” names. Would not a rose by any other name smell as sweet? Judge the person by their actions, not their label (though in this case their labeling was their own action.)


Please post your issues and solutions to these or other issues. If you have more issues and are worried about stepping on toes and don’t want to post them on your name, shoot me a note in Mabi or a PM here and I’ll post it for you without naming names. Now is a time to deal with everything and get a fresh clean start.

Transfer leadership or new guild?
I’m not sure how complete the Mabinogi guild interface is and if Inyala can transfer leadership. If she can’t, how many of you would be willing to join another guild built from the ashes of this one? I will, if we can learn from this and build a better guild as the result.

P.S. I hate when I spend a while on a post, and when I go to post it the forum forgets who I am and I have to sign back in, losing everything I worked on. Sad
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Re: IMPORTANT: Guild expiration - we need input!

Post  .haze. on Wed May 21, 2008 7:59 pm

the leader should also be a North American legitimate player... this is not to cut out certain individuals from the leadership chain, but the last thing the guild needs is a banned leader with no access to NX and no way to change leadership...

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Re: IMPORTANT: Guild expiration - we need input!

Post  serihon on Wed May 21, 2008 8:26 pm

Who should we contact about individuals we think would be fit to lead? or should we just post here?
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Re: IMPORTANT: Guild expiration - we need input!

Post  Darke on Wed May 21, 2008 8:38 pm

.haze. wrote:the leader should also be a North American legitimate player... this is not to cut out certain individuals from the leadership chain, but the last thing the guild needs is a banned leader with no access to NX and no way to change leadership...

Good point, Haze. Sorry for everyone this disqualifies, but I agree.


Serihon wrote:Who should we contact about individuals we think would be fit to lead? or should we just post here?

Just post it here. Open discussion is very important in this process. These are open nominations, though I hope everyone will take it seriously and not just nominate people to curry favor with them. Multiple nominations from a single source are welcome. If someone is worried about posting a nomination for whatever reason, PM me and I'll post the nomination without naming where it came from.

Any nominees who feel they can not fulfill the role, especially the subscription and legality requirements, should also use this thread to withdraw.
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Re: IMPORTANT: Guild expiration - we need input!

Post  Captincrunch on Wed May 21, 2008 9:09 pm

Leader Nominations
If we are to go on as a guild I definitely agree that we need a new leader.
I personally feel that I can easily pass all but two requirements myself. Those being time and charisma. Which for me, both are in small supply.
Unfortunately I may not be able to participate in the vote this weekend unless I get some net time in late, late Saturday ….. Anime North has me body and soul.

Now on to the points made
1. As the guild gets bigger I think a more open and robust review process would be in order. My idea would be a combination of probation and a guild interactive interview. All done in character of course. Sort of a welcome and meet the folks event done on a regular basis
2. “There’s not enough RP in the RPS.”
This is where mentoring of the less experienced but still enthusiastic is needed. Good role players that are born are few and far between, so most are made, and usually from the most shy and introverted people.
3. “Not enough officers/leadership.”
This needs to be well thought out and a core team with trustworthy associates added to delegate some responsibilities too. We need to decide how many is needed and how many is enough.
4. “There’s too much drama.”
The only DRAMA I want or expect is to be in character, between characters. I whole heartedly agree that Real Life ™ stops at the login screen. We role play to get away from that.
5. “No one helped me.” “People kept whining at me to do things for them.”
These are related issues with two root causes. Spreading yourself too thin and Leeches. The first is remedied by self discipline on both parties when it comes to help. The second can only be remedied by a gentle reminder with possible shunning or a Boot. Unfortunately most Leeches have other a-social behaviours that warrant the application of a steel boot to a bodily appendage.
6. “There are poorly named people in the guild.”
A name is a name is a name and sometimes all the good ones seem gone or a person has a moment of silliness or two * raises hand * Best to judge by actions or better yet, interactions to find out the truth of the matter, no matter how strange.
Would not a rose by any other name smell as sweet? It may but it always tastes better with a bit of sugar and almond paste.

P.P.S. I also hate when I spend a while on a post, and when I go to post it the forum just up and disappears. Post never to be seen again.
........................
PPPPS - nominations Rolling Eyes almost forgot Darke, Haze and Kaly .... all have demonstrated good social skills and a reasonably thick enough skin and sense of humor.


Last edited by Ranma on Wed May 21, 2008 9:54 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Re: IMPORTANT: Guild expiration - we need input!

Post  serihon on Wed May 21, 2008 9:22 pm

My Nominations are:

Darke
1. He has been very friendly and active in the game and guild.
2. He has posted very useful and helpful responses in the forum and also in the alliance chat.
3. Very helpful when I have questions or issues I wish to ask someone about.

Kalypstra
1. Very friendly and active. I think she has hidden of late, but I am unsure as I have not been on for the past week or so.
2. Willing to help others.

Raoul
1. Steps up to lead others in groups with helpful advise.
2. Very friendly with others and encourages RP.

There are just three of the many I believe would make good leaders.
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Re: IMPORTANT: Guild expiration - we need input!

Post  Nowaki on Wed May 21, 2008 10:58 pm

One key point: They must subscribe to the Expanded Storage service, or the full fantasy package. Just subscribing to Nao's help package IS NOT enough.

Sadly, Inyala and I already talked to Raoul, and his out-of-country status makes it impossible for him to take over, since he can't obtain NX.
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Re: IMPORTANT: Guild expiration - we need input!

Post  Kagaea on Wed May 21, 2008 11:56 pm

I still don't know everyone, but I think I Darke wouldn't be a bad choice. The simple fact he's posting this thread means he has leadership potential.
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Re: IMPORTANT: Guild expiration - we need input!

Post  Raoul on Thu May 22, 2008 12:35 am

Well, as some members promptly pointed out, I'm not eligible, Serihon.

Altough I really wish I could...

Well, since I'm a card off the deck, the only thing I can do is offer my services as I've been doing lately, regardless of my position.
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Re: IMPORTANT: Guild expiration - we need input!

Post  Raoul on Thu May 22, 2008 12:36 am

Nowaki wrote:One key point: They must subscribe to the Expanded Storage service, or the full fantasy package. Just subscribing to Nao's help package IS NOT enough.

Sadly, Inyala and I already talked to Raoul, and his out-of-country status makes it impossible for him to take over, since he can't obtain NX.

Nowaki, in fact I can obtain NX, but I'm temporarily unemployed, so thiings are hard for me.

I got my first rebirth card on monday...
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Re: IMPORTANT: Guild expiration - we need input!

Post  Nowaki on Thu May 22, 2008 3:20 am

Raoul wrote:
Nowaki wrote:One key point: They must subscribe to the Expanded Storage service, or the full fantasy package. Just subscribing to Nao's help package IS NOT enough.

Sadly, Inyala and I already talked to Raoul, and his out-of-country status makes it impossible for him to take over, since he can't obtain NX.

Nowaki, in fact I can obtain NX, but I'm temporarily unemployed, so thiings are hard for me.

I got my first rebirth card on monday...


Oops, sorry! I misunderstood the situation. Many appo9logies.

But, in any case, Raoul's agreed that he's not eligible, even though we think he'd make an awesome leader.
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Re: IMPORTANT: Guild expiration - we need input!

Post  Razielle on Thu May 22, 2008 4:34 am

I'm up for nominating Kaly~


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Re: IMPORTANT: Guild expiration - we need input!

Post  Senitaru on Thu May 22, 2008 6:19 am

I'm up for Nominating Darke And Kaly.
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Re: IMPORTANT: Guild expiration - we need input!

Post  Kalypstra on Thu May 22, 2008 8:46 am

I would like to take a moment to thank all those that have nominated me as a leader. As much as I would -love- to be guild leader, my real life situations make it rather difficult for me to be able to do many things and I may disappear for several days due to them. With that said, I would like to Nominate Darke and mention that I would be willing to serve as an officer under him. He is kind, understanding, and just. He is a -very- close friend of mine and I would be willing to follow him through anything. I love this guild and I have a desire to see this guild pull through. We -can- survive this, and we will.

Darke wrote:“Few of the members are active.” “Many members wouldn’t talk to me.” ”The guild is too big.” “The close knit society feeling has disappeared.”
I would like to mention, you get as much out of this game as you put in. If you think people aren't friendly enough, chances are that they aren't trying to ignore you, they could be just busy. If you are new to our guild, you need to make the steps in initiating our friendship. Not to say the members of the guild are scott free. As members of a -society- all members should extent a hand of friendship, but this needs to be two sided. You can't just sit in Guild chat silent and expect people to be friendly to you. Just because you are on the guild list, doesn't mean we know you are online. So new members and old members alike, make an effort to say hello.

Darke wrote:“No one helped me.” “People kept whining at me to do things for them.”
No one likes people who whine, and I'm not exception. I'm -always- willing to help those in the guild in need, all that's needed is to be asked. But again, due to RL Situations, sometimes mid dungeon I may need to take a moment to rest. Usually I can just tough through it, but there are times I cannot. I will always be here to help in any way I can and I hope I can be of service to the guild. On that note, those that are asking for the help need to realize that we have things we'd like to do as well. We can't just be expected to drop everything and help you just because you need our help. I roleplay a romance between Tris and Kaly, so I may be rping at the time you are asking for help. Patience is needed and whining just makes people not want to help you.

Darke wrote:“There’s too much drama.”
Ok, this one just makes me giggle inside. No offense to Nowaki and Inyala, cause I love you both, but leaving is not helping our drama issue, it's creating more for us to handle. Which you are, so lovingly, leaving in our laps. With that said, drama is double sided. It take two to tango, and as someone who has been upset by several people in this guild at some point I can understand. As a guild on an online game, we collect people form all forms and walks of life with varying opinions. But, another part of a guild is setting aside our differences and moving onward, together as a team! Yes, more officers should be had to help ensure that most arguments, etc, don't boil over, and I'd be willing to be one of them. There are several things everyone should keep in mind. Tolerance and patience is needed by all. There are in game outlets, such as the Arena, that -can- be helpful in working out your frustrations. And most importantly, you don't have to leave the guild or the game on the account of one person. It's as simple as black listing them if they bother you that much, and then you never have to hear from them again.

Eventually, the people that don't belong in the guild, for whatever reason, will exclude themselves and we'll be left with those willing to work and roleplay along with the others. We don't need numbers to be a good guild. Quality over quantity.

Most everything else that I'd like to mention is covered, but I'd like to reiterate that I decline the nomination for guild leader, but will be more then willing to be a supporting role in the leadership as an officer. Again, thank you to all those that felt I would be a good guild leader, but I think it should be turned to Darke. He is level-headed, calm, kind, generous, and fair. And as one of the people that calls him a close friend, I would trust him with anything. With that said, Good luck Darke and everyone keep chugging forward.
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Re: IMPORTANT: Guild expiration - we need input!

Post  Raoul on Thu May 22, 2008 9:52 am

Kalypstra wrote:I would like to take a moment to thank all those that have nominated me as a leader. As much as I would -love- to be guild leader, my real life situations make it rather difficult for me to be able to do many things and I may disappear for several days due to them. With that said, I would like to Nominate Darke and mention that I would be willing to serve as an officer under him. He is kind, understanding, and just. He is a -very- close friend of mine and I would be willing to follow him through anything. I love this guild and I have a desire to see this guild pull through. We -can- survive this, and we will.

Darke wrote:“Few of the members are active.” “Many members wouldn’t talk to me.” ”The guild is too big.” “The close knit society feeling has disappeared.”
I would like to mention, you get as much out of this game as you put in. If you think people aren't friendly enough, chances are that they aren't trying to ignore you, they could be just busy. If you are new to our guild, you need to make the steps in initiating our friendship. Not to say the members of the guild are scott free. As members of a -society- all members should extent a hand of friendship, but this needs to be two sided. You can't just sit in Guild chat silent and expect people to be friendly to you. Just because you are on the guild list, doesn't mean we know you are online. So new members and old members alike, make an effort to say hello.

Darke wrote:“No one helped me.” “People kept whining at me to do things for them.”
No one likes people who whine, and I'm not exception. I'm -always- willing to help those in the guild in need, all that's needed is to be asked. But again, due to RL Situations, sometimes mid dungeon I may need to take a moment to rest. Usually I can just tough through it, but there are times I cannot. I will always be here to help in any way I can and I hope I can be of service to the guild. On that note, those that are asking for the help need to realize that we have things we'd like to do as well. We can't just be expected to drop everything and help you just because you need our help. I roleplay a romance between Tris and Kaly, so I may be rping at the time you are asking for help. Patience is needed and whining just makes people not want to help you.

Darke wrote:“There’s too much drama.”
Ok, this one just makes me giggle inside. No offense to Nowaki and Inyala, cause I love you both, but leaving is not helping our drama issue, it's creating more for us to handle. Which you are, so lovingly, leaving in our laps. With that said, drama is double sided. It take two to tango, and as someone who has been upset by several people in this guild at some point I can understand. As a guild on an online game, we collect people form all forms and walks of life with varying opinions. But, another part of a guild is setting aside our differences and moving onward, together as a team! Yes, more officers should be had to help ensure that most arguments, etc, don't boil over, and I'd be willing to be one of them. There are several things everyone should keep in mind. Tolerance and patience is needed by all. There are in game outlets, such as the Arena, that -can- be helpful in working out your frustrations. And most importantly, you don't have to leave the guild or the game on the account of one person. It's as simple as black listing them if they bother you that much, and then you never have to hear from them again.

Eventually, the people that don't belong in the guild, for whatever reason, will exclude themselves and we'll be left with those willing to work and roleplay along with the others. We don't need numbers to be a good guild. Quality over quantity.

Most everything else that I'd like to mention is covered, but I'd like to reiterate that I decline the nomination for guild leader, but will be more then willing to be a supporting role in the leadership as an officer. Again, thank you to all those that felt I would be a good guild leader, but I think it should be turned to Darke. He is level-headed, calm, kind, generous, and fair. And as one of the people that calls him a close friend, I would trust him with anything. With that said, Good luck Darke and everyone keep chugging forward.

I totally second this post, and given all the issues Kalypstra addressed, I guess no one here could be a better leader than Darke. I'd like to volunteer to aid him on whatever he need to do to make this guild a shiny diamond again.
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Re: IMPORTANT: Guild expiration - we need input!

Post  serihon on Thu May 22, 2008 10:01 am

I have agreed with everything Darke and Kaly posted. I also would be willing to help Darke where needed... but only if I get some cookies first. Serihon hasn't had any sweets in a long time. Laughing But seriously I would be willing to help out where I can.
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Re: IMPORTANT: Guild expiration - we need input!

Post  Kahlen on Thu May 22, 2008 11:03 am

Since I was so very kindly asked to put my input into this, here I am doing just that. I'm not a member of the guild anymore, but given that the majority of my Mabi buddies ARE, this does have some affect on me. Now. Let's see here...

It was very obvious that after a few valiant attempts at wrangling the troops, the leaders of the guild basically washed their hands of us. That's never a good thing with things such as this and as Kaly mentioned, exacerbates the drama some. When the leaders get too fed up and worn down, it's obvious some pretty big changes need to be made.

Everything that Darke mentioned is a valid point. My vote's in favor of a new, fresh guild, since there is a bit too much damage control to be done with this one. The only way I think this can be fixed is if there is a massive effort to remove members that have never even been seen before, or possibly booting everyone that doesn't have a character profile and/or membership request on this forum.

The roleplay aspect took a backseat to a numbers game, it seems. And as a guild devoted to...well...roleplay, that shouldn't be tolerated for too long. It's also the case that, despite repeated mentionings of when we use OOC and when is the time for IC, some members just don't care. The new leaders need to be the kind of people that are willing to help those that seem a little lost but also be firm enough to remove them if the problem persists.

Speaking as a shy person, I know there's a very, very good chance that some people that have joined just don't talk because they feel intimidated by certain cliques among the guild. Hell, I was one of the older members and *I* felt intimidated by them. What might be beneficial is having maybe a...Big Brothers/Big Sisters type program? Meaning, a senior member (or members) of the guild could have an applicant shadow them for a while as part of the application process to get the person familiar with how things run, and also take note of the applicant's ability to be in character and all that fun stuff. It could really cut down on people that show up to a roleplaying guild with no idea how, why, or when to roleplay.

If only about 20% of the members making themselves known in the guild chat and in the forums, then perhaps the remaining members are those that need the boot. Whoever has to be leader has a sucky job ahead of them and I wish them the best. I suppose since Darke has taken the initiative, maybe he ought to go ahead and do it. I can help with anything else needed, definitely.


Last edited by sweded on Thu May 22, 2008 11:06 am; edited 2 times in total (Reason for editing : Fedd? Really? Ugh. Brain ache. Fixing spelling and grammar.)
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Re: IMPORTANT: Guild expiration - we need input!

Post  Auramune on Thu May 22, 2008 11:52 am

Despite the bickering she and I go back and forth with on occasion, I think Kaly would be perfect for the guild leader.

I'm not exactly sure what's been going on.. people leaving suddenly, for whatever reason, but if it's because of other members and fighting I think you all should get over yourselves.

Yes, even you Haze.

A community only works well when people get over their differences and accepts one another for who and what they are. I can't tell you how sad I was to find that Iro left the guild. And for what? I still have no clue.. and now I find out that Kahlen left? Who's next? Raoul? Darke? This has to stop now.. and I think that Kaly will be the best choice to put her foot in the asses of trouble makers, and flim-flam.

Not to say that Inyala and Nowaki didn't do their share. Leading this many members is tough. But, there comes a time when hand holding and pampering won't do. I'd hate to see this guild go under. It's refreshing to talk to friendly people whenever I come to play. Especially you all, who I've come to adore.
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Re: IMPORTANT: Guild expiration - we need input!

Post  Nowaki on Thu May 22, 2008 1:58 pm

I understand that my own backing out of Mabinogi can be considered a source of drama, and I do sincerely apologize for that. But, in my personal case, I deal with drama all day long, every day. I got worn out logging into a videogame that only caused me more stress, and taking a role in which I frequently got complained at. For the welfare of my business, my writing, and my own health, I had to take a step back for a while and try to find another way of relaxing that didn't cause me so much heartache.

I am not quitting Mabinogi, but I will warn that my involvement will be sparse in June and the first half of July, because my work takes up so much of my time. I plan to continue playing Mabinogi, primarily as a social game rather than to build and strengthen a character. Once again, I am sorry that I am not financially or emotionally able to take over leadership of the RP Society at this point in my life.
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Re: IMPORTANT: Guild expiration - we need input!

Post  .haze. on Thu May 22, 2008 2:45 pm

Sulia wrote:
Yes, even you Haze.


whats the big idea?! =P

nah, i left for reasons that will probably never be resolved, though i am still close to the guild and would do anything for most of its members. I won't rejoin though, I don't see a reason to.. whats been done is done, and i still <3's the guildies n stuff, the ones that care know where to find me ((hint hint.. you make fabric there XD))

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Re: IMPORTANT: Guild expiration - we need input!

Post  Captincrunch on Thu May 22, 2008 3:30 pm

A good point was brought up in that maybe the guild did expand faster than the leadership could handle or the guild to absorb.

A social guild based on RP is much more of a challenge to put together and administer as opposed to a dungeon crawlers club or monster mashers inc. (good names BTW ... nah)

I propose that we put together a plan of action for the short term and then have a go at long term goals, including expansion.

- Get a Leader/Sponsor
- put together a team to help the poor sod
- keep them in beer if need be (optional)
- systematically address each membership and keep, probation or boot.
- lets have some fun again (what? were not having fun?)

Long Term
Get that uber pretty gold capped guild stone
Design a badge / sheild
Designated mascot (I nominate Haze)
etc etc etc
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Re: IMPORTANT: Guild expiration - we need input!

Post  Irochozo on Thu May 22, 2008 5:22 pm

I have my reasons for leaving, but just because I'm no longer a guildie does not mean that you won't see me anymore. 9 times out of 10 if I'm online, I'm with Kahlen. So if you can find her, you can find me.
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Re: IMPORTANT: Guild expiration - we need input!

Post  .haze. on Thu May 22, 2008 5:36 pm

Ranma wrote:
Designated mascot (I nominate Haze)
etc etc etc


WHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

OH THE WHEEL IN THE SKY KEEPS ON TURNIN, I DON'T KNOW WHERE I'LL BE TOMORRROOOWOOOOOOOO

hell yes to that nomination

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Give input where input is asked...

Post  JagdtMirage on Thu May 22, 2008 6:05 pm

Well, let's see.

From what I observe, and my opinions are my own. The guild grew, and it grew to be too much for the two who tried shouldering it to manage. I saw a lack of delegation going on.

I think there should be more officers to spread the load out, now that the guild is of significant size.

It's what businesses do.

A president of a corporation delegates to managers of teams, vice presidents, and executive officers.

When the president of a corporation needs to for reasons who knows, depart, they leave the board of directors in charge, or the officers in charge. Sometimes they just take a backseat role.

I've been at the head of RP organizations (guild factions, castes, clans, tribes, sects) in RP environs, and I watch 'leader burnout' happen 80% of the time because people were not delegating things they should have.

In the business world, if you've got a problem with your boss, you go to the boss over your boss. If if you've got a problem with your coworker, you go to your boss and have them mediate.

And that said; I think there needs to be more than one person and one officer in whatever RPSociety becomes.

The load MUST be shared. People MUST have more than two people to go to with interpersonal conflicts. People MUST realize, that there is a point, where you can't please EVERYONE.

Roleplay requires a large degree of maturity, I come from years of working in text-only environs where you have your use of language, your charisma, and your interpersonal skills to work out your differences.

Some of the best RP I've had has been growing a faction in a sci-fi game, then gaining the majority of players on the server under my wing, teaching them how to do what I did, and ... okay so getting assassinated wasn't part of my plan, but I rolled with it, and attended my own funeral & the resulting wake as a character I'd had set aside that nobody really connected to 'the big boss'. But the organization functioned for years because I'd delegated and trained people in case I wasn't available.

Took a lot of training people how to RP too. That can sometimes be about as fun as a trip to a Russian Dentist.

There WILL be people who interacting with seems like dragging nails across the chalkboard, this is where learned tolerance & whatnot come into play.

Insofar as the cost of maintaining a guild, I've done this in the past, but I wouldn't feel hurt by tossing a $10 NX card towards the guild every other month or so to help keep up the 14500 NX it'd take for a guildmaster. I wouldn't mind a volunteer-option for donations to such.

-Jagd
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Re: IMPORTANT: Guild expiration - we need input!

Post  Darke on Fri May 23, 2008 7:35 pm

I’ve noticed that the guild’s expiration has moved to June 25th, so I think we should all thank Inyala for that. You have my gratitude, Inyala and everyone who donated to the guild fund! We’re safe until we resolve the change of leadership and we aren’t so rushed now, though I still think we should do it as soon as we can so we can start working on these problem issues.

I didn’t realize when I posted that I would end up being the leader, but it looks like I’m the only nominee who can take the position. There’s still time to get in more nominations, if anyone would like to make them.

If I do become leader:
I plan to make Kalypstra and Raoul officers. They are both respected members of the guild and even though neither could become leader for certain reasons, I wholeheartedly agree with their nominations and think they will help a lot with the guild. If anyone has a problem with them becoming officers, send me a message here or in Mabi and I’ll be happy to discuss your concerns.

I also plan to have Nowaki and Inyala remain officers, if Inyala will stay in the guild. They are the mothers of RPSociety and put a lot of work into it. Even is they’ve lost the desire to lead actively, I look forward to seeing them come around in the game and would not dream of excluding them from the future development of their baby.

I’d like to also make Kahlen (known as sweded here in the forums) an officer. I’ve talked her into giving RPSociety another chance and she easily fulfills the various traits I look for in an officer. I hope there are no objections to her officer status. If there are, message me. I’m not forcing anything on the society and will consider everyone’s input on officers and all issues.

I’d like a limited access forum for the officers. I’m not sure how everyone feels about a private officer forum, but I think it’s important we have someplace to discuss things in private so that we can present a unified stance on important issues. I love everyone I’ve listed so far in my officer selections, but even the six of us will disagree from time to time and we need someplace to work it out.

We can also use this or an extra private forum to log and discuss disciplinary actions and such things. Keeping records of how, when, and who we take action upon is a very important aspect of leadership. Keeping it for officers only helps prevent embarrassment and negative stigma against people who slip up every once in a while.


Addressing some specific concerns:
Kalypstra wrote:Eventually, the people that don't belong in the guild, for whatever reason, will exclude themselves and we'll be left with those willing to work and roleplay along with the others.

Unfortunately these sorts make the guild unbearable for many good members and often cause members to leave before they themselves quit. If there’s conflict in the guild that two parties can’t work out for themselves, we have to do something about it. The officers will have to step in to arbitrate. If they can’t resolve things with the help of the officer and refuse to simply leave one another alone, the officer will have to take more drastic steps.


.haze. wrote: i left for reasons that will probably never be resolved
They can’t be resolved if we don’t discuss them. That’s why I wanted to get everything out in the open now so we can work on it. I don’t know why you left, but I respect your right to keep it to yourself. If you’d like to help us fix it, now is the time to speak up. Smile

As I said in the first post, if anyone wants to send me a PM I would be happy to post their additional concerns so they don’t have to worry about negative repercussions from their statements.


JagdtMirage wrote: I wouldn't mind a volunteer-option for donations to such.

There is a donate button on the forum’s portal page (http://rpsociety.heavenforum.org/portal.htm). As I understand it, all proceeds from these donations go to extend the Society duration.


sweded wrote: there's a very, very good chance that some people that have joined just don't talk because they feel intimidated by certain cliques among the guild. Hell, I was one of the older members and *I* felt intimidated by them.

I’m at a bit of a loss here. How do we get rid of this unintentional intimidation? Regular social events might help, but it’s hard to get everyone together at once for something like that. Do you think formal introductions for new members would help? Perhaps instead of just a current member list, we should also have a list of new members on the forum so existing members know to go introduce themselves and help integrate the newcomers into the Society.


Mentors
I love the idea of mentors as Kahlen and Ranma mentioned. We need people to step up as mentors; befriend the newcomers, take them under your wing and help them develop good roleplaying habits and get involved with the guild.


It doesn’t stop there though. Each and every member should do what they can to make the newcomer feel comfortable and welcome. Since Mabi unfortunately does not let us know when guildies log in, we should make sure that each newcomer is in the friend’s list of at least their mentor and hopefully a few other members, so we know when they are online and can greet them warmly.

I realize now that I’ve been a bad society member. I know very few of the people on the membership roster and that’s not right, especially if I’m going to become the society leader. If I can’t picture the person when I look at their name, then I’m not connecting with them. They won’t feel comfortable talking to me. My alt has only received halfhearted hellos when he greets the guild. Only one person who didn’t know I was him has taken any steps to get to know him. (Thanks for the friend invite, Sulia. Smile ) He’s a mule and now I only use him for bank space and an extra advanced item per day, but he illustrates the symptoms of the sickness.

I’m going to go through the member list and try to get to know each person on it. It may take me a little while to get all the way through it, but that’s my goal. I think everyone in the guild should do the same. Once a day (or whenever reasonable given your amount of play time) pick a name on the list that you don’t know and try to meet with them. Just whispering to them won’t do. :p See what’s going on with them. Help them out if you can. Bring them a plate of your cooking or play them a song. Share your handiwork and show interest in theirs. If they aren’t online, send an in game note introducing yourself and saying that you would like to get together some time and get to know them better! If they aren’t responsive, they may be distracted or afk. (I’m often distracted by several discussions at once.) Don’t assume the worst, just shoot them a note. If you see someone with an RPSociety tag that you don’t know, take a moment to get to know them. If we each make connections with one unknown guildmate per day, the guild will actually become a society.
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